My Summer Lair Chapter #25: A T-Shirt Is Delicious If You Have Good Taste, Right?
It happens. Podcasting is a technical endeavour which means there will naturally be technical cock-ups. You can record the best interview ever with the most famous guest ever but if the audio is lousy it’s the worst ever.
This is what happened to me back in April 2016. I was at the FITC Conference (which stands for Future. Innovation. Technology. Creativity. Fresh, yes?) here in Toronto and my podcast guest was Johnny ‘Cupcakes’ Earle.
I was thrilled at the opportunity to talk to Johnny. We both enjoy magic, read comic books and wear t-shirts we designed. I mean…how are we not BFFs?
The My Summer Lair interview went well, the technical aspects did not. Bah! As I said: It happens.
Talk to any podcaster who has recorded 20 or more episodes and they’re got a horror story about something going wrong or lost episodes that would frighten Stephen King.
I won’t subject you kind listeners to the ugly audio; even Superman couldn’t save this sucker. But thanks to magic of A.I. the text of my conversation with Johnny has been saved which is I what I present to you now.
(A rather full circle moment for me…I started writing Q and A style interviews in the National Post chatting with Russell Peters before graduating to an audio podcast.)
Shall we begin?
Yo: Welcome to My Summer Lair I’m your host Sammy more shake than bake Younan. Here’s a sweet conversation with the founder of the world-renowned t-shirt brand, Johnny Cupcakes. From selling t-shirts out of a suitcase to opening brick and mortar stores across the US, Johnny ‘Cupcakes’ Earle shares the secret ingredients to his success and his ah…Cupcake community.
It took a while to find his passion…along the way he was a magician and a DJ but now he’s cooking up unique t-shirts armed with witty cupcake-based designs that prompt a strong devotion from his fans. Like dude is at tattoo level…fans are getting his designs inked. I’ve two or three t-shirts and I’m good for now.
Hopefully this introduction has left you hungry for my conversation with Johnny ‘Cupcakes’ Earle.
Johnny Cupcakes:
All right: let’s do this.
Sammy:
All right: let’s do this.
Sammy:
I want to start at the beginning; when you were a magician.
Johnny Cupcakes:
Mm-hmm.
Sammy:
And you were into magic. What was the initial spark that got you into magic? What was like the, “Yo, I’m in for this. This looks cool.”
Johnny Cupcakes:
Man. Magic is…magic’s the greatest. The greatest thing in the world. I still do magic tricks every single day, to this day. My wife actually pretends it’s her first time seeing it every time I do a magic trick.
Sammy:
She gives you that face and that, “Ooooooh.”
Johnny Cupcakes:
To get the crowd excited. She’s almost like my assistant without being a magician’s assistant. I don’t know that she’d want to be called that, but she’s a good sport. But what got me into magic?
I like to surprise people. I like to play tricks on people. I like to make people smile. And doing magic just kind of encompasses all of that. You know when I was a kid, my dad would always pull endless quarters out of my ears.
And when my parents got me this magic kit for Christmas—it was either Christmas or my birthday—I think Christmas, and I just couldn’t get enough of it. I wanted more. I wanted more books. And I just kept exploring from there and started doing magic tricks at birthday parties for $20 a half an hour. I only knew a half hour’s worth of magic, so it really wasn’t a lot of money.
Sammy {Laughing}:
And then you would disappear.
Johnny Cupcakes:
And I would disappear. It was great. Magic is a cool thing. I brought a few tricks with me today, so I’ll have to show you after the show.
Sammy:
Did you bring some magic that you’re going to do for your talk here at FITC?
Johnny Cupcakes:
Yeah: I’m not going to do any magic on stage because most of the magic I do is close-up magic. But I’m going to walk around and freak people out. I’ve already got a few good reactions in the elevator. And on the streets today I was walking to go get some ramen, and I stopped a few random groups of people. It’s good.
You know when I was younger, magic helped me come out of my shell. It’s one of those things that I guess weird people do? You do magic. I didn’t really know how to dance, so I became a DJ at one point and decided to play the music for people. They’re these little social exercises, and I don’t know. I just think magic is the greatest.
Sammy:
Magic is the greatest. When you say you do close-up magic, what does that entail for people who are not familiar? Because there are different types of magic. So, what is that…oh…you’re going to do some magic right now?
Johnny Cupcakes:
Yeah, I’ll show you right now.
Sammy:
All right.
Johnny Cupcakes:
This is my first audio magic trick.
Sammy:
All right!
Johnny Cupcakes:
So, closeup magic is when I’m pretty much getting close up, so you can really see what’s happening.
Sammy:
Right.
Johnny Cupcakes:
So, right now I’m going to show you this coin that’s on the palm of my hand and on the count of three, you look really close. You ready? 1…2…3:
Sammy:
Oooooh! Snap!!!
{Both laugh}
Sammy:
I don’t know how to describe that to like…
Johnny Cupcakes:
How would you describe that? {Laughing}
Sammy:
Yeah: it was like you had a coin on your hand; on the palm of your hand, and then you had it with your other hand on top of it, but you could still see the coin. And then this like third plastic baby arm came outta nowhere.
Johnny Cupcakes:
Yeah, I carry around a baby arm with me everyday.
Sammy:
I don’t know how you got that through the airport.
Johnny Cupcakes:
I’ll show you another little…it’s not really magic, but it makes me feel good. So, I always carry around this photo of my pride and joy. This is what it looks like.
{Both laugh}
Sammy:
And it’s literally, his pride and joy. The detergent and the…I guess, the dishwasher?
Johnny Cupcakes:
Yeah, it’s just a photo of two fancy sitting bottles of soap.
Sammy:
There you go. Classic. How does getting into magic, then segue into being an entrepreneur? Because you are all about spectacle. You’re about connection, and magic is the same thing. You want people to have a good time and to figure out how you did what you did.
Johnny Cupcakes:
Really good questions. Yeah. I just love to make people feel like it’s their birthday anytime they purchase a Johnny Cupcakes T-shirt. And with all businesses that I’ve started, the outcome is great. It’s nice to have a positive outcome.
But more than anything, for me, it’s the process of figuring out and putting together this puzzle of, “All right. We have to release a T-shirt. What are we going to do? All right. Game of Thrones is coming back on TV soon. Let’s make a chubby version of John Snow eating a cupcake and call it Johnny Snowcakes, and maybe we’ll release that with a Wolf T-shirt. And if we had more time, we could give out little plastic swords with every purchase…” and we just keep building up from there.
We’ve done a baseball theme T-shirt packaged in a Cracker Jack box with a little vintage baseball card inside. We’ve done Halloween movie theme T-shirts packaged in VHS tapes to go along with the fake movie title that’s on the cover of the VHS tapes and the T-shirt designs, like Count Spatula or Rise of the Two Headed Zombie Chefs.
And then, I’ll go as far as setting the store up, the T-shirt shop up, like a haunted house for the Halloween shirts. I’ll even rent out a hearse and a coffin from a creepy dude on Craigslist.
But it’s only $220, which is cheaper than a $20,000 advertisement. And for me, spending 220 bucks on something as weird as a coffin and a hearse, when I get delivered in that for the grand opening of the T-shirt release, everybody on Newbury Street in Boston is going to be stopped trying to figure out what the heck’s going on.
So, I’ve always taken my advertising budget and put it into building unique experiences around the brand. And by doing that, the people do the talking for you. But more than anything, it makes work not feel like work.
Sammy:
Well, that’s magic too, though.
Johnny Cupcakes:
That is. Yeah.
Sammy:
And magic, we’ve seen it evolve because it’s no longer just a dude with a couple of card tricks or something like that now. Right?
Johnny Cupcakes:
Yes.
Sammy:
Darcy Oake and other magicians like that now are doing really big tricks that involve props and water and all kinds of action adventure type stuff.
Johnny Cupcakes:
Yeah. That’s true.
Sammy:
So, it’s spectacle. It all goes back to spectacle.
Johnny Cupcakes:
Yep. And I think you can do that with any business, with most businesses. Some restaurants do it great, whether it’s a speakeasy or a…do you guys have the Rainforest Cafe in Canada?
Sammy:
We did, yeah. I think it died…it’s extinct. BAM!
{Both laugh}
Johnny Cupcakes:
It didn’t have the best food in many people’s opinions. However, a child could not walk past this establishment without dragging his or her parents inside because of that spectacle. You’re eating food, and there’s alligators jumping out at you, and the chance of you choking on your food is incredibly high, which is maybe why they closed down.
But yeah, spectacle is good.
Sammy:
Does a lot of the spectacle also come from, or is informed by your background…you worked in comic books, as well, and you read comic books. When you see superheroes like Batman and Superman and Spider-Man, does that influence your idea of what spectacle is?
Johnny Cupcakes:
Yeah. I’d say there’s a little bit of influence there. More than anything, I would say a lot of the influence comes from being a kid and opening up cereal boxes to get that toy at the bottom. And now, it’s very depressing and lonely. You have to type in a 30-digit case-sensitive code to maybe win, but they’re winning because they’re making money off the advertisements that you’re seeing when you go to the website to type in the code to win in the prize.
Sammy:
But! Your elbow doesn’t get as dirty though now. So, there is some pluses and minuses…
Johnny Cupcakes:
Exactly. {Laughing} So, there’s a yearning for that. And my mom used to pretend that I would have to go with her to run errands and do some chores. And I’d hop in her car and I didn’t know where we’re going. All of a sudden, I see a Ferris wheel in the distance. And my mom surprises me and takes me to a carnival.
Sammy:
Good mom.
Johnny Cupcakes:
So, that sense of wonderment has always been in my blood. And I love…some of my friends and family members will yell at me every year because I like to get Christmas presents for everybody. If I hear someone talking about something from their childhood, I will make a note of it in my phone.
One year, I asked all of my employees what their favorite childhood Christmas memory was, and then I went out and I found all of those toys on eBay.
Sammy:
Wow.
Johnny Cupcakes:
Some for $30. Some for $350. But I had to get these toys for them because I knew that it would bring them back to this very special time. For me that that is what I live off of.
Sammy:
I want to talk about then, your community, because you have a…I guess a Cupcake Community, for lack of a better term.
Johnny Cupcakes:
Yes.
Sammy:
You share a lot in your talks and your videos and interviews like this: you push the idea of entrepreneurship and anyone can do it and fail fast and these great ideas, but how do you turn them? When you first started, you just had a couple of consumers. People were like, “I like the shirt,” and they bought it. How do you turn those consumers into a community then?
Johnny Cupcakes:
Well, it wasn’t a master plan.
It was me being very personal with everybody. And that’s something that I still do 15 years later. When someone would buy a T-shirt from me, I’d give them a vintage Ghostbusters, Ninja Turtles, or New Kids on the Block trading card. Or I’d remember their name.
Or at one point, I started these things called Cupperwear Parties instead of Tupperware…cupperwear like you wear cupcake T-shirts. And I would offer people a free shirt if they invited me over to their house, their work, or their school, and they invited their friends to shop.
Having that personal interaction with people. I’d go to craft fairs, farmer’s markets, concerts. I wanted to learn about my customers and what they want and what they don’t want. And I was just really fascinated that anyone even cared about buying a T-shirt, and I still am. So, I think being involved really helps this community grow.
For instance, sometimes when I travel, I’ll post on my Snapchat (johnnycupcakes) or my Instagram or Twitter. I’ll say, “Hey, it’s Johnny Cupcakes. I’m in San Francisco for the day. If you meet me at this pizza place, I’m going to treat you to lunch, as long as you show up with a Johnny Cupcakes T-shirt on. A few hours go by, I roll up to the pizza place, and I’ll think maybe four or five, maybe 12 people will show up if I’m lucky. 400 people show up. We can’t even fit in the place.
I have to bring every person to Union Square Park. And I spend the day feeding pizza to people and learning about how they got into the brand. And not just with pizza…with ice cream, with dodge ball, with grilled cheese…and I love that.
It doesn’t cost much money to make somebody feel good.
And you could even do things where you don’t have to spend money: just thanking your customers and having cool launch parties, having random meetups in different locations. And I don’t know. That hunt…that community building scavenger hunt like Willy Wonka style is something that really makes me thrive.
Sammy:
And then, does this go back to what you were saying before about wonderment and spectacle?
Is that one of the defining characteristics of this community then, as you meet all these different types of people? Because I’ve seen all the images you have on your website and on Facebook, and it always looks like it’s just different types of people. Is there any sort of characteristics or themes that run through the Cupcake Community?
Johnny Cupcakes:
Well, there is not really a demographic. I mean, yeah, there’s a lot of people between the ages of…I don’t know, 18 and…28? But we have customers from two years old to 92 years old. And if I had to think of a characteristic that they would all share is I’ve learned that a lot of them are, or were, collectors of things at some point in their life.
I’ve always collected things from toys to stamps to Marvel trading cards, magic tricks. Some of these people have had collections too, but now they collect Johnny Cupcakes T-shirts, and some of them have more shirts than I own.
Some of them have thousands of Johnny Cupcakes products. Someone even made a website called Complete Set where people can file and showcase their collection, their Johnny Cupcakes collection, and they branched off, and they do that with other brands now, too. But it’s really remarkable seeing and hearing where people are willing to go.
Sammy:
Are you constantly surprised and amazed that it’s gotten to this point?
Johnny Cupcakes:
Yeah. I’ve seen more than 2,000 Johnny Cupcakes tattoos on people. I’ve seen neck tattoos, arm tattoos, face tattoos. I’ve seen tattoos I wish I didn’t see.
Sammy:
That’s unfortunate.
Johnny Cupcakes:
But it all stems from this passion with the brand, whether they were inspired to start their own company, whether they met their best friend or significant other through the company, or they just like the logo.
But yes, it does surprise me. And I don’t ever want to jeopardize this. I want to keep making it special and exciting for them.
I’m redoing our Boston shop right now, redesigning it with my dad, and next month, for the 15th-year anniversary of the company, but 10 year anniversary of our Newbury Street Boston shop location, we are bringing stuff from our LA extended pop-up shop back to Boston.
And so, when you walk into the Johnny Cupcake shop in Boston, you’re going to have to go through a second entrance to get inside, which is going to be a 12-foot tall, massive vintage oven that secretly opens up, and then bam, you’re in this bakery that doesn’t even sell cupcakes. It’s T-shirts and refrigerators. The store smells like frosting. Your shirts come in pastry boxes. But in the store, I’m going to hide a secret button—
Sammy:
Oh!
Johnny Cupcakes:
… a secret doorbell. I don’t know where it’s going to be. For instance, there might be a framed photo of a clown, but you’ll notice his red nose is raised up a little bit. And if you push it in, a bell goes off, and someone comes up to you, pulls you aside, shows you a secret menu.
On that secret menu is limited-edition shirts that the public doesn’t have access to. And we are working on, and hopefully it goes through, but we’re working with a really cool donut company in Boston to carry donuts in our store and to change up those flavors every day.
Sammy:
This sounds amazing.
Johnny Cupcakes:
We kind of have all these little things and want that menu to change every day, every week, and just make people feel like a kid again.
Sammy:
We’ve really lost the art of the hidden…you know when you have the library and you pull on that triggered book and whole shelves slide back and there’s a hidden lair underneath there or back there.
Johnny Cupcakes:
My old house, I built a…well, my dad and I built a library shelf that secretly opens up, and it brings you to this secret office in my house.
Sammy:
Yes! And so when you talk about this community and you talk about spectacle and you talk about wonderment, all these things are great. Is this how you’re ultimately defining success?
Because at the end of the day, you are running a company, and it needs to be profitable or else you can’t keep doing all these things, unfortunately.
Johnny Cupcakes:
Yeah. No, that’s very true.
Sammy:
So, how are you fully defining success?
Johnny Cupcakes:
Well, I’ve definitely been carried away with providing these experiences for customers, so much so that I focused on that it was my strong point. And there’s been times where I lost track of the business, where our expenses have gone up, or we keep giving employees raises, even if the company hits a couple bumps, or even if their jobs don’t change whatsoever.
And sometimes during those times, we will incur more costs by moving to a bigger warehouse, a bigger headquarters. Or all of a sudden, we get hit with this $4,500 business tax that we have to pay every quarter in Boston.
Or all of a sudden, people decide they want to dress up like grownups now, and they don’t want to wear cool graphic T-shirts.
So, it’s always a challenge. I definitely fail every day. I’m not a superhero. I’m just a little dude who’s not afraid to fail. And through that, I have learned a few forms of success.
Financial success, yes, you’re right. It’s important or else we can’t do the fun things for anybody and nobody has a good time. But those fun things are so important to me that I’ve recently hit the reset button with my company, and unfortunately, I had to lay off a few employees because that was our number one expense. And we’re a family-run independent brand, so we screw up in a few places at once, our cash flow is well…you need to be really creative.
But yeah, unfortunately we had to make a few changes, but I have never felt so happy in my life. And I think it’s because there have been times where I’ve felt this financial pressure to sacrifice my brand ethics, such as lowering the price on our shirts or having a sale every week just to make this extra money because we have to pay these extra costs for these extra employees or this new headquarters that we got.
And that’s a lot of pressure, and it makes work not fun. And then, all of a sudden you’re not thinking about the exciting things. You’re just pumping out work for the sake of paying bills as quick as you can.
So, now that we’re cutting back, we’re saving a lot. A good friend of mine told me, as you grow your brand, there’s a point where you start to realize that the best way to grow is to save.
So, by cutting back these costs, I have far less pressure and able to do more of these fun things, such as focusing on the shop, having a secret menu. And that is success to me. I also got married this year.
Sammy:
Yo: high five for getting married.
{Both high-five!}
Johnny Cupcakes:
Yeah. And I feel great. I have put my personal life on the side for more than a decade. I would spoon with my laptop at night and get sad when a romantic comedy would come on but…
Sammy:
It’s tough.
Johnny Cupcakes:
It is tough. But I knew I had to focus on the brand and just really put 110% into it. And now, I feel like I have a good balance going on and a great team, and I really want to make time for that personal life.
So, for me, success is having a good work-life balance and not sacrificing your brand beliefs and just making people feel like a kid having a good time, making strangers smile.
I’m a street magician who does it for the fun of it, not even for the money. I just go around and do magic tricks. And that’s really creepy to a lot of people. But I…
Sammy:
You’re here for a good time.
Johnny Cupcakes:
I’m here for a good time, and that’s what my purpose in this life is.
Sammy:
All right. Well, time’s up. So, thank you.
Johnny Cupcakes:
Hey. This is some of the best questions I’ve ever received.
Sammy:
Oh, yo. We got to do another high five for that one, then. Thanks.
{Both high-five!}
Johnny Cupcakes:
Seriously, it’s really gotten to the core of who I am and what is so special about this brand, how it got there. And nobody’s ever kind of connected those dots.
Sammy:
I mean…it is in a sense now getting a lot easier to start up a business and to get products out the door. Right?
Johnny Cupcakes:
It is. But you can’t replicate authenticity for that magic.
Sammy:
Exactly.
Johnny Cupcakes:
Anyone can start a business, and you can buy a domain name, you know make an online shop. All that stuff’s there. But to build brand loyalty is a very fragile thing to do.
So, in my spare time, in between my passions, my other passion is speaking or helping companies come up with ways to build that brand loyalty, which is great for me because I can take all these ideas that I really don’t have time to do and just give them to these different companies.
Sammy:
Are you seeing more and more people taking that risk to become entrepreneurs, or do you still see people who are fearful or hesitant, or “It may not work out.” types?
Johnny Cupcakes:
It’s interesting. Entrepreneurship has turned into this…it’s great. It’s a class. It’s a course that you can now take at school. Whereas before, it used to be a weird word that was really hard to spell.
And I don’t know if it goes against entrepreneurship to be spending all of your time learning about entrepreneurship instead of getting your hands dirty and learning hands on, but I think it’s great. Yeah, I actually think it is very valuable.
Everybody has ideas. There’s a lot of people that are just afraid to take that risk. A lot of people are afraid to fail. I think it comes down to that, too.
So, many people just won’t start something because…what’s their friends going to say if it goes wrong? What’s their family going to say? What are their parents going to say? And how’s it going to feel if all the money you saved up is gone?
It’s definitely a good wake up call.
Sammy:
I know people like that too: who say I can’t do it because there’s no guarantee…
Johnny Cupcakes:
Oh, but that’s the excitement. Oh my God. That’s the drug for me is—it’s like gambling. You don’t know what that card is going to be when it flips over, but? It’s the wrong card, you get more motivated. You get more motivated than ever because you have to figure it out.
Sammy:
Right.
Johnny Cupcakes:
All of a sudden, you have to figure it out. And there might not be anyone there to help you do that. When poo poo hits the fan at work, and people freak out, I’m the only person smiling because I feel that excitement of having to think strategically, and that’s great.
Sammy:
Man. I’m surprised actually, you haven’t done a podcast.
Johnny Cupcakes:
I know: I have to just start this thing as soon as I can. But hey; next time I’m in Canada, I’d love to do another talk.
Johnny Cupcakes @ W • T • F
Host & Photography Sammy Younan
Recorded: Saturday April 16, 2016 at 6:00 pm (at FITC)
Stress free pop culture tastefully harvested for your divine delight. Once a week a carefully curated edition of My Pal Sammy goes directly to your inbox. Sign up for my newsletter so we can have some fun…like looking cool in our Johnny Cupcake t-shirts!
